Why Do We Call Defective Cars "Lemons"?

"SteveLehto" (stevelehto) 02/17/2015 at 13:30 • Filed to: None

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I practice Lemon Law which means that I represent consumers who have bought defective cars. Ever wonder why we call a defective car a Lemon ? As you might guess, I can tell you all about it.

It does seem odd that the word Lemon has become so !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! . After all, in any other context a lemon is just a yellow citrus fruit. But when you see the word in a piece on this site, you know it is a reference to an unfixable vehicle.

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The notion that Lemon might mean something bad or defective has been around since at least the 1800s. There is often disagreement on word origins, so I will be the first to admit that none of this is carved in stone. But most sources I can locate show the first obvious uses of the word to denote a bad or defective thing around that time. Interestingly, it was used first as an insult, to describe a stupid person. According to the Oxford English Dictionary , the term lemon appeared in print in 1863 in that manner, a synonym for dimwit.

Why the negative connotation at all? Why not an orange, or banana? Perhaps it is because the lemon is quite sour tasting, despite its bright and cheery appearance. For such a happy-looking fruit, one cannot just chomp into it the way one might with an orange or banana. It may be that the first to use the word this way meant something which looked nice but did not live up to expectations upon closer examination.

But it was 1909 in the Saturday Evening Post where the OED found the first reference to an undesirable non-human thing being described as a lemon . "The wheel goes around; wherever the little indicator at the point of the pin stops, there is your prize – or your lemon."

Its first use in print to describe a bad car seems to have been in the U.K., in a 1931 edition of the Morning Post , where a man described selling "five lemons" for 210 British Pounds. The paper noted for its readers "'Lemon' was a term used in the trade for second-had cars of little value."

According to the OED , lemon was used to describe other things of questionable value but the attachment to defective automobiles became stronger as cars became ubiquitous. I do wonder if a car company today would use an ad such as this, run by Volkswagen in 1960. I understand the point they make with those words beneath the "Lemon" but I suspect most car companies would balk at such an association today.

Of course, those things sold like hotcakes and the ad is now considered a classic. But those were different times.

The meaning of the word lemon became more nuanced over time. The Saturday Review mentioned in 1972, "Mechanics are less than delighted to see lines of lemons converging on their service department." The implication there was that lemon did not just mean defective but had a connotation that the cars were difficult to repair.

The term even caught on in Australia, where I am told they speak a version of our language. The Sydney Morning Herald , 1972: "The effect of this on consumers is too many lemons or part lemons coupled with near impossibility of obtaining redress from the manufacturer."

Of course, it was during the 1960s that Ralph Nader's work, Unsafe at any Speed focused the nation's attention on automobile quality and safety. It wouldn't be until the 1980s that states started passing Lemon Laws but they did not call them that. They gave them names like "An Act Concerning Automobile Warranties," or "New Motor Vehicle Warranties." The latter of those two is the poetic result achieved by the Michigan State Legislature, but they do note on their website that the law is popularly known as the Lemon Law .

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Steve Lehto has been practicing law for 23 years, almost exclusively in consumer protection and !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! He wrote !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! and !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

This website may supply general information about the law but it is for informational purposes only. This does not create an attorney-client relationship and is not meant to constitute legal advice, so the good news is we're not billing you by the hour for reading this. The bad news is that you shouldn't act upon any of the information without consulting a qualified professional attorney who will, probably, bill you by the hour.

cazzyodo > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:40

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But I love lemons!

SteveLehto > cazzyodo 02/17/2015 at 13:41

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So do I (and I mean BOTH kinds!)

cazzyodo > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:41

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Steve, you're an ok guy.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:42

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This, of course, is more of a lymon.

$kaycog > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:42

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Both bad cars and lemons make you go like this.

SteveLehto > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 02/17/2015 at 13:43

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I'm not quite sure WHAT that is.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:43

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I should also point out that the infamous #3 cylinder makes some aspects of the "less maintenance" claim rather bald-faced.

SteveLehto > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 02/17/2015 at 13:46

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I do not know as much about these particular cars as others on this site, so this would not surprise me one bit.

Thanks for the note (I did include the highest res of the ad I could find so people could read it if they wanted).

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:46

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Corrected, because contrary to what I thought, Sprite marketing spells it "Lymon". This is not an officially related car to Coca Cola, of course. No, this is more of a theme donk that belonged to a guy in serious financial trouble - tax fraud.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:48

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Depending on where they were operated (i.e. typical outdoor temperatures), the #3 cylinder on the Beetle was known for running hot and requiring valve adjustment - very, very frequently.

SteveLehto > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 02/17/2015 at 13:49

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Wait - you want to drive your car outdoors? That's crazy talk.

Imirrelephant > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:49

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Monstrosity is the word I would use...

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:50

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*Insert Charlie Sheen driving car while under house arrest ad here*

Blunion05 drives a pink S2000 (USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST) > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:52

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I sure do love me some Le Mons.

Margin Of Error > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:58

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Because they leave a bitter taste in our mouths

davedave1111 > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 13:59

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For such a happy-looking fruit, one cannot just chomp into it the way one might with an orange or banana. It may be that the first to use the word this way meant something which looked nice but did not live up to expectations upon closer examination.

That's how I always understood it: a lemon looks good on the outside, but leaves a bad taste in the mouth.

Incidentally, you can't just chomp into a banana or orange. You have to peel them first. There's a rather charming story about young English kids after the Second World War, who'd never tasted bananas before due to the blockade. Apparently they'd heard all about bananas from adults and older kids raving about them and everyone talking up the anticipation as the first loads of bananas hit the docks again — and then these poor kids would be given their first banana, this nice yellow fruit they'd been told was so delicious, and they'd bite right in the way you would with English fruit like apples and pears.

davedave1111 > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:00

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It's not so much that I want to drive outdoors as that I'm not rich enough to afford a suitable indoors.

SteveLehto > Margin Of Error 02/17/2015 at 14:02

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So do many other things, theoretically.

SteveLehto > davedave1111 02/17/2015 at 14:03

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Technically, you have to peel a lemon too (if one wanted to chomp into it. Which I would not advise).

I remember an episode of "Room 222" where a character claimed the banana peel was nutritious as well. Never tried it as I am not sure if a bad 70s sitcom is an accurate source of nutritional information.

lonestranger > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:07

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This damned song is stuck in my head, and now it's in yours too.

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U2 - Lemon by Angkor

QQXQXL123 > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:23

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It just had to be British, didn't it?

(full disclosure: I'm British)

StevenG > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:24

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I must the be only human who eats lemons like oranges or grapefruit, do that with limes too.

Chairman Kaga > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:24

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I was curious as to the rate of buybacks and/or lemon filings related to defective touchscreen/infotainment systems.

A personal story... Our 2014 Highlander XLE has been back to the dealership three times since we bought it a year ago, all for problems with the system. I won't go into great detail, but in short it doesn't work. They have upgraded, updated, replaced, rewired and shrugged their shoulders. The last call from the service manager to my wife was basically, "We have no idea. What do you want us to do?" And my wife said, "I dunno, fix it?" His response, "I can't guarantee we can do that. You might just have to live with limited functionality."

That's not an acceptable answer. We'd take it to another dealer and try their service department but we also feel sort of like this dealer needs to deal with it, or deal with us.

Sort of at wit's end with this thing.

SteveLehto > StevenG 02/17/2015 at 14:24

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Do you do this often?

SteveLehto > Chairman Kaga 02/17/2015 at 14:26

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Been hearing a lot of problems with those systems in various makes of cars. It seems that most of them work fine but the few that are whacked out just can't be fixed.

Straightsix9904 > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 02/17/2015 at 14:26

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You only have to find one car that it requires less Maintenance than. It is true that a VW bugs requires less maintenance (than an F1 car). I know that takes it to the extreme, but an air cooled single carb engine probably really did require a LOT less maintenance than cars of its era.

MK6GTI-now with added Miata > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:28

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Where were these people when my car rolled off the line in Wolfsburg? My passenger dome light was shorting out when I took delivery with 30 miles on it. I guess they have more to check now...

StevenG > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:29

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As often as I eat oranges or grapefruit. Not a big fruit eater, though. In restaurants I always end up eating the lemon slices out of the water.

Maxxuman > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:29

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Here's one I wouldn't want to squeeze into, unless I was juiced.

SurvivedAPintoCrash > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:29

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My theory was that it was for Citröen, which looks similar to Citron, lemon... similar as Fix It Again, Tony... Maybe sometime Citröens were unreliable...

SteveLehto > MK6GTI-now with added Miata 02/17/2015 at 14:29

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Actually, all those guys are now 100 years old, since the ad was in 1960. They're doing the best they can, considering their age.

SteveLehto > SurvivedAPintoCrash 02/17/2015 at 14:30

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I had noticed that too - and always wondered if the French called defective cars "lemons" (but in French) or not.

detailer4u > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:33

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I could take that one to places we really don't need to go ................

Doctor-G-and-the-wagen > $kaycog 02/17/2015 at 14:33

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Except I actually like lemons and can eat them almost peel and all, while bad cars make me want to drive into a ravine.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:33

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For such a happy-looking fruit, one cannot just chomp into it the way one might with an orange or banana

Maybe YOU can't.

MK6GTI-now with added Miata > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:34

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You know what I meant!

I wonder how they feel about VW's iffy quality reputation in the US these days.

Griffen > StevenG 02/17/2015 at 14:35

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I do this too.... Lemons, Limes, their juice right from the plastic bottle that loooks like them, Taco Bell sauce packets, Italian dressing from the bottle, Balsamic vinegar, Cholula (i like the Chili Lime one best) ummm I'm sure there's more but that's all that comes to mind off the top of my head.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > StevenG 02/17/2015 at 14:35

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A wedge of lime or lemon in the morning wakes me up much faster than coffee.

SteveLehto > MK6GTI-now with added Miata 02/17/2015 at 14:37

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Of course I know what you are talking about. I suspect they tried harder back when they were trying to break into the market.

DavidHH > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 02/17/2015 at 14:39

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Or #2 on the dog house cooler dual ports. But actually it was the $hitty exhaust valves, as #1 and #4 also failed, but were not going to be the first to drop.

Andrew Daisuke > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:41

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RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > DavidHH 02/17/2015 at 14:42

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Of course, knowing someone who was into waterboxers, one of the "cures" is worse than the disease.

SteveLehto > Andrew Daisuke 02/17/2015 at 14:42

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Damn Shelbyville!

DavidHH > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:44

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Actually Citron is a type of lemon, and Citroën 's used to be the most unreliable and difficult car on the market. As in to get parts you have to know the year, month and date it was made. And to tow a broken Citroën with a flat bed tow truck, you have to first tow it in gear, to inflate the hydraulic suspension.

DavidHH > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 02/17/2015 at 14:47

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Actually I've seen waterboxers that went 150 K miles, but our Westy only has 65 K miles, so I have not found out yet if it has a decent engine.

MK6GTI-now with added Miata > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:47

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Good point. More to lose. Now that they have loyal customers, I guess they can afford to let quality slide a little.

sklooner > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:49

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If God give you lemon's, find a more benevolent God

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > DavidHH 02/17/2015 at 14:50

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This was less "repeated bad engines" and more "leaks - leaks everywhere". Which contributed to the engines being quasi-bad, but not bad on the merits, quite.

TheStigsGermanCousin > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:50

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They be fresh, they be acidic, they be... LeMons.

stoke > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 02/17/2015 at 14:53

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So does a punch in the jaw, although you won't find me starting my day with either.

vacantserver > MK6GTI-now with added Miata 02/17/2015 at 14:54

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Perhaps because inspectors for U.S.-market vehicles no longer have names like "Kurt Kroner”? Now, they have names like “Billy-Bob Bumpkin” and "Manuel Maquiladora”.

Sterling89 > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:56

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Had a dog once that would eat banana peels - pretty sure he wasn't concerned with the nutritional value however. He also liked crickets when he could catch them. Sadly, he's now departed this mortal coil.

Eddie Brannan > stoke 02/17/2015 at 14:56

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Bravo

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > stoke 02/17/2015 at 14:57

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Really? Normally when I punch people in the jaw it has the opposite effect.

SteveLehto > Sterling89 02/17/2015 at 14:58

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I have dogs and am well aware that they can somehow digest anything they can get their mouths around. Keeps me busy when I walk them since they will sometimes find things in the grass that they think make fine snacks.

Cars AND Coffee!? > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 14:59

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A formalized definition and discussion of the lemons idea can be found in Akerlof's well known paper on information asymmetry, 'The Market for Lemons," written circa 1970. Certainly not the first time the term was used, but he was the first to communicate just why exactly so many used cars were below a certain quality standard. The crux of the argument is that the market is a 'market failure' insofar as high quality used cars are underpriced because buyers of the used vehicles are uncertain whether or not the car was serviced properly, etc, and therefore those vehicles tend not to be offered for sale at all. Thus, the information asymmetry, or disconnect, between seller and buyer drives prices and qualities down, generating the 'market failure'.

That's just a little practical Economics 101 for today...

Eddie Brannan > davedave1111 02/17/2015 at 15:01

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There's a quite charming story that Jacques Pepin recounts about being a young kitchen apprentice when a delivery of then-exotic avocados was made to the restaurant he worked at. In French (and indeed in British English when I was growing up) avocados are known as avocado pears, so he assumed it was some kind of amazing pear that he hadn't yet had. Pears then being a scarce luxury, he dreamed of biting into this exciting new variety, and in the end managed to steal one and take a big, juicy chomp. Bonjour tristesse.

SteveLehto > Cars AND Coffee!? 02/17/2015 at 15:04

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I wish I understood that. I just found the article now and may try wading through it later. It is interesting that Akerlof discusses lemons without ever noting where the term comes from. I would have thought it merited a lengthy footnote (isn't that what footnotes are for?)

Thanks for the note.

Union of Smog Techs of CA > $kaycog 02/17/2015 at 15:12

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Will putting sugar and water in the car solve the problem then?

Daywalker > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 15:13

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Back then, in econ journals, articles were very short so footnotes are used sparingly. You've probably seen legal research where half or more of every page is footnotes. There are far fewer, and far shorter, footnotes in econ/finance/accounting.

theshinobi01 > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 15:15

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Ha nice write up as usual, this is why I am on Jalopnik 24/7, best articles.

SteveLehto > Daywalker 02/17/2015 at 15:16

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I've also written a few scholarly papers (labor history and so on) where the footnotes dwarfed the text. That's where you can put the good stuff!

Daywalker > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 15:18

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Yes! Steve is one of us!

Cars AND Coffee!? > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 15:25

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Yeah - He must have just viewed it as conventional wisdom that bad (used) cars are lemons? Shows how implanted the term must be in consumer psyche

Dr. Mantis Toboggan, M.D. > TheStigsGermanCousin 02/17/2015 at 15:30

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Is that John Lemon?

Jim is one of KFCs secret ingredients > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 15:33

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when life gives you lemons make that shit a lemons racecar

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 15:36

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"Of course, those things sold like hotcakes and the ad is now considered a classic."

I have, at times, questioned how well hot cakes are really selling. I know I never buy them. I never see anyone else buying them all that much.

I'd rather have a waffle with strawberry sauce and maple syrup instead of those crappy hotcakes McDonalds sells. I see waffles selling far better than hotcakes overall.

Now if you say "it sells like beer on a hot Saturday afternoon at a Chicago Cubs game"... THAT is something I would agree sells VERY well.

DavidHH > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 02/17/2015 at 15:38

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And a lower temp thermostat was all most waterboxers needed.

SteveLehto > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly 02/17/2015 at 15:38

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The market for hotcakes is not what it used to be, true. I am basing this (the sales of VW vis-a-vis hotcakes) on what I have been told (since it happened a short while before I was born).

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > Margin Of Error 02/17/2015 at 15:42

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Find Lemons to be sour, not bitter.

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > sklooner 02/17/2015 at 15:43

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Or at least ask for some fresh water and some sugar to make lemonade...

The Spaceman > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 15:44

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If the "Big Three" had implemented funktionspufstands in the '60s, you may never had entered the business you're in today.

curbwatching > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 15:45

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Did I miss the part of the article where the origin of "lemon" to mean "bad car" is actually explained?

I read it twice. I still don't understand how "lemon" came to mean "stupid," or "bad."

albo > Doctor-G-and-the-wagen 02/17/2015 at 15:47

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Ew. I had a friend who did that. He also ate the entire apple, core and all. You weirdos.

SteveLehto > curbwatching 02/17/2015 at 16:03

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You only read it twice?

Most of my stuff needs to be read three or four times to make any sense. Read it again.

Jordaneer, The Mountaineer Man > theshinobi01 02/17/2015 at 16:25

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Is it wow?

Chairman Kaga > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 16:32

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Is "just can't be fixed" grounds for buyback? I think if after this next visit, which will involve replacing two separate computers and the head unit yet again, that's our only acceptable option.

The ironic thing is the Toyota Entune system is supposed to be the best available, at least according to Consumer Reports.

Thanks!

SteveLehto > Chairman Kaga 02/17/2015 at 16:36

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Substantial defect that persists after the requisite number of repair attempts. "Substantial" is the question here. Depends on your state law and so on.

Chairman Kaga > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 16:47

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We're in texas.

Great.

liam > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 17:13

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Summary from The Word Detective:
'It's likely that the current use of "lemon" to mean "something that doesn't live up to its billing" or "a disappointing purchase" comes from a combination of "lemon" in the "sucker" sense (i.e., the buyer got "taken") and the much older sense of "lemon" meaning "something undesirable."'

http://www.word-detective.com/2010/09/lemon/

Jdrentarol > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 17:15

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But... the Beetle is sweet...

SteveLehto > liam 02/17/2015 at 17:17

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I saw a couple of websites like that one (I had not seen THAT one though) but there is not a whole lot to go on other than when the term first appeared in print and so on. Beyond that it starts getting murky.

Thanks for the note.

Jdrentarol > $kaycog 02/17/2015 at 17:18

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ferdburful > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 17:26

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In Sweden, they called them "Made on Mondays". Appropriate, I think.

Griffen > StevenG 02/17/2015 at 17:33

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You are not alone. I do this too. Then again I like lemon and lime juice right out of their fruit shaped plastic bottles, and Taco Bell sauces packets, and Balsamic Vinegar from the bottle, Italian dressing from the bottle, honey mustard sauces, Cholula (especially the Chili Lime flavor)... Maybe I have a problem....

$kaycog > Jdrentarol 02/17/2015 at 17:35

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Perfect!

SteveLehto > Jdrentarol 02/17/2015 at 17:46

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That was their point. Their cars are so good because they stop the bad ones from getting sold.

SteveLehto > ferdburful 02/17/2015 at 17:47

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We say that here too.

RW53104 > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 17:53

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Steve- I notice a lot of people ask you for advice (in so many words) in the comments here. I would love to see a piece (unless I missed it) explaining how to go about finding and contacting a lemon lawyer, when you should consider doing it, and what you should expect to pay. I've never considered meeting with a lawyer for anything, because I always assume I can't afford it.

SteveLehto > RW53104 02/17/2015 at 17:56

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I did write this one. And lemon law lawyers get paid by the manufacturers so they will always give you a free consultation. http://oppositelock.jalopnik.com/how-to-find-an…

RW53104 > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 18:04

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Well thanks. I was just about to call Saul.

SteveLehto > RW53104 02/17/2015 at 18:05

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RW53104 > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 18:17

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You really do have all the answers. Thoroughly impressed.

SteveLehto > RW53104 02/17/2015 at 18:25

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Thanks!

Next > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 19:03

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Its the opposite of a Le mons car xD

TheStigsGermanCousin > Dr. Mantis Toboggan, M.D. 02/17/2015 at 19:22

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lol.

fritzo > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 19:32

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I'll point out that old slot machines in the 1800's also featured lemons indicating "loser".

SteveLehto > fritzo 02/17/2015 at 19:49

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I saw some references to that but I think those came later. That is, the slots used lemons after the word had acquired that meaning in English.

curbwatching > SteveLehto 02/17/2015 at 19:53

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Is the answer really in there?

SteveLehto > curbwatching 02/17/2015 at 20:00

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I thought so. No one else has asked.

I point out that it is speculation but it appears to have evolved for a couple reasons and so on. . .